Welcome to Gaia! ::

I think we are making great progress in Iraq, and I think they elections will help form a more stable government. This is essentially there first shot at a representative form of governing, so it will take time to transition. Maybe they might need to revamp their whole Constitution, lest we forget our first choice was the Articles of Confederation. I think overall, a stable representative government is better for the culture, economy, and security of Iraq. I think that we were first governed by a "rag, tag militia" and I think that the Iraqis should soon be close to self-sufficient forces for security. And we can set up a training camp there, and we still have forces in Afghanistan as well.

Maybe it's just me, but election after election, I just dont see any progress being done. The constitution passed, the government was "stabilized", but Iraqi infrastructure remains wrecked, and with no hope of being repaired any time soon. There's no slowdown in the terrorist attacks, troops and civillians arent any safer, and the natural path of democracy will lead to a government identical to that of Iran, if not rule by Iran itself ( barring full-out civil war in which the Iran-backed side loses).

Installing a stable, pro-american democracy with civil rights and the works in iraq is physically impossible. It will not happen. Not in our lifetimes. It will end in sharia law, no matter how many Successful elections happen, and regardless of wether the US government fixes the elections ( as I have suspected since the begining) or if they simply let democracy take its course. It is the only possible outcome. Stop fooling yourselves

Only fools rely in best-case scenarios.

and what's gonna happen once we withdraw?

Legally. But, considering that there is no ability to enforce any kind of law in more than half of Iraq and the vast majority of Afghnaistan, I wouldnt really count that as progress.

erm...no
I still fail to see why you right-wingers expect a closely-watched election to be the time where all the terorrists come out to play. They are, in fact, probably the low points of the attacks ( also: as far as I know, that's one attack in the polling places,-one more than lst time, btw- not in all of Baghdad)

Ok then: it took christianity 2000 years to advance to its current state of modern though, ( and it isnt even done yet) and it went through a period of torture, war, and Genocide. Why dont we allow ISlam the same Time Frame? after all, i'm sure that if we just give them 600 more years to go through ytheir own persecutions and inquisitions, they'll eventually get tired, much like Europe did.


Open Fire whne there was an organized army.
ever since his government collapsed, the american casualty rate has remained steady. And I dnt know why, but I have a gut feeling that civilian deaths have risen ( though we dont have any reliable numbers.no, the white house 30,000 isnt reliabable and is outright laughable)


Um...after WW2, we still have troops in germany. Because that is totally what we want from Iraq, to have troops there 70 years later in an area that isnt even as friendly to us as europe was, and will only aid in the destruction of all order that we impose.

beleive me, I am a strong beleiver in making the rebuilding of the infrastructure a priority, and then hauling a** outta there. thats the best we can hope for