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 Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:12 pm
Despite being a feminist, I have never felt as if I were the second-class citizen because I carry a uterus within me. Now, being that I'm 19 and in college and have yet to face job descrimination and whatnot, it could just be my lack of experience out in "the real world."
I know sexism is all around me, but when I look at myself, I have never felt as if i were second-class. I've felt that I've been misjudged but that's natural. You're going to be misjudged because judging is . . . just there.
Now, when I look at other women, usually those older than me, I see that they may feel like a second-class citizen because they grew up with that mentality, which makes me pretty sad.
Maybe I'm just unaware and could care less about the norms of my community/environment in general, but my question for everyone is—do you feel like a second-class citizen because you are a woman?
Please explain.
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Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:22 pm
I know how you feel....
"Woman is the ****** of the world." - John Lennon
Mugh as I hate the n word, I think that's pretty true. Sexism happens in all races and cultures.
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Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 10:35 pm
I personally have been paid less because I'm female. My boyfriend, who took my job after I left got a full $3 more an hour then I did. Being interested, he talked to all the guys and girls at the place to see how much they were paid, the boys were consistantly paid more for the same job.
This was at a restuaraunt when I was 18.
I've been sexually assaulted by so called friends, I've been followed home, or followed when walking by creepy guys, I've had a stalker, I'm afraid to walk alone at night.
All these experiences relate to my being a woman. I don't know if 'second class citizen' is the phrase I'd use, but yes. I feel 'less than'
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:04 am
I feel that I'm a second class citizen because I dare to say and act like I think is right. If something bothers me, I say about it. Usually I don't think what I say, I say what I think.
I don't understand the paid thing. Why do guys get paid better from the same jobs? Do they have a golden p***s? I mean we work just as hard as they do and we totally have just as much talent as they do. There are no "womens jobs" and "mens jobs" just like there's no girly colours and boyish colours.
John totally hit the jackpot when he wrote Woman is the ****** of the world. I hate the N-word too but that song totally knew its place.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:56 pm
Sexism is pervasive and illusive. It has been made to be invisible by society. We live and breath culture, and part of our enculturation has been sexism, so it is not always easy to spot.
Being a second class citizen means that we don't get equal treatment, that there are systems of oppression against us. I don't think that this is necessarily always dramatic and very obvious, sometimes it's little things. But either way, nearly everyone in this thread has identified times when they felt discriminated against due to their gender, which I think confirms women as second class citizens.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 3:39 pm
I normally don't see such discrimination. I think it is more of the individual rather than a group that is descriminated against. But you are right. Sexism screams in society for both males and females. But society masks it to think that's how we are so that the man will always be a moron and the woman will always be evil. I hate the idea when we just need to be equal from the start.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:53 pm
savy squirrel Sexism is pervasive and illusive. It has been made to be invisible by society. We live and breath culture, and part of our enculturation has been sexism, so it is not always easy to spot. Being a second class citizen means that we don't get equal treatment, that there are systems of oppression against us. I don't think that this is necessarily always dramatic and very obvious, sometimes it's little things. But either way, nearly everyone in this thread has identified times when they felt discriminated against due to their gender, which I think confirms women as second class citizens. No s**t. What I wanted to know is if "you" felt like a second-class citizen and why.
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Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 10:10 am
LuthienTinuveil savy squirrel Sexism is pervasive and illusive. It has been made to be invisible by society. We live and breath culture, and part of our enculturation has been sexism, so it is not always easy to spot. Being a second class citizen means that we don't get equal treatment, that there are systems of oppression against us. I don't think that this is necessarily always dramatic and very obvious, sometimes it's little things. But either way, nearly everyone in this thread has identified times when they felt discriminated against due to their gender, which I think confirms women as second class citizens. No s**t. What I wanted to know is if "you" felt like a second-class citizen and why. There was no need to be rude. I was saying that I feel that I, along with all women are second class citizens and that almost everyone here has confirmed that by identifying being discriminated against for being a woman.
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Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 9:38 pm
savy squirrel LuthienTinuveil savy squirrel Sexism is pervasive and illusive. It has been made to be invisible by society. We live and breath culture, and part of our enculturation has been sexism, so it is not always easy to spot. Being a second class citizen means that we don't get equal treatment, that there are systems of oppression against us. I don't think that this is necessarily always dramatic and very obvious, sometimes it's little things. But either way, nearly everyone in this thread has identified times when they felt discriminated against due to their gender, which I think confirms women as second class citizens. No s**t. What I wanted to know is if "you" felt like a second-class citizen and why. There was no need to be rude. I was saying that I feel that I, along with all women are second class citizens and that almost everyone here has confirmed that by identifying being discriminated against for being a woman. I think that in this lifetime, you're going to experience a variety of discriminations no matter what, because it's unavoidable. You'll be discriminated against for being fat or skinny, pale or tanned, black or white, college-educated or high school drop-out, parent or single, economic status, religion, political beliefs, male or female, intergender, transgender, homosexual, bisexual, pansexual, asexual, introverted, extroverted, etc. I mentioned in my post that I don't feel like a second-class citizen despite experiencing discrimination. It's pretty understandable that many women do feel like second-class citizens and because of discrimination. The problem is that discrimination is an easy answer. I want to know -why- you feel discriminated against. Because everyone looks down at your breasts? Because you aren't paid as much as someone else? Because you're expected to be a mom? Because you aren't supposed to do male things? What are the reasons for why you feel like a second-class citizen?
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Posted: Tue May 08, 2007 3:05 am
I definately feel like the second sex, since it seems that the man is the measure for just about everything...
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Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 3:23 pm
LuthienTinuveil savy squirrel LuthienTinuveil savy squirrel Sexism is pervasive and illusive. It has been made to be invisible by society. We live and breath culture, and part of our enculturation has been sexism, so it is not always easy to spot. Being a second class citizen means that we don't get equal treatment, that there are systems of oppression against us. I don't think that this is necessarily always dramatic and very obvious, sometimes it's little things. But either way, nearly everyone in this thread has identified times when they felt discriminated against due to their gender, which I think confirms women as second class citizens. No s**t. What I wanted to know is if "you" felt like a second-class citizen and why. There was no need to be rude. I was saying that I feel that I, along with all women are second class citizens and that almost everyone here has confirmed that by identifying being discriminated against for being a woman. I think that in this lifetime, you're going to experience a variety of discriminations no matter what, because it's unavoidable. You'll be discriminated against for being fat or skinny, pale or tanned, black or white, college-educated or high school drop-out, parent or single, economic status, religion, political beliefs, male or female, intergender, transgender, homosexual, bisexual, pansexual, asexual, introverted, extroverted, etc. I mentioned in my post that I don't feel like a second-class citizen despite experiencing discrimination. It's pretty understandable that many women do feel like second-class citizens and because of discrimination. The problem is that discrimination is an easy answer. I want to know -why- you feel discriminated against. Because everyone looks down at your breasts? Because you aren't paid as much as someone else? Because you're expected to be a mom? Because you aren't supposed to do male things? What are the reasons for why you feel like a second-class citizen? Ok, sorry it took me a while to get back on this one. Finals fried my brain. I guess the primary reason for me is that women are treated as sexual objects and exploited to sell things is high on the list. The way our culture is so very male centered also makes me feel like a second class citizen.
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Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 9:35 pm
savy squirrel LuthienTinuveil savy squirrel LuthienTinuveil savy squirrel Sexism is pervasive and illusive. It has been made to be invisible by society. We live and breath culture, and part of our enculturation has been sexism, so it is not always easy to spot. Being a second class citizen means that we don't get equal treatment, that there are systems of oppression against us. I don't think that this is necessarily always dramatic and very obvious, sometimes it's little things. But either way, nearly everyone in this thread has identified times when they felt discriminated against due to their gender, which I think confirms women as second class citizens. No s**t. What I wanted to know is if "you" felt like a second-class citizen and why. There was no need to be rude. I was saying that I feel that I, along with all women are second class citizens and that almost everyone here has confirmed that by identifying being discriminated against for being a woman. I think that in this lifetime, you're going to experience a variety of discriminations no matter what, because it's unavoidable. You'll be discriminated against for being fat or skinny, pale or tanned, black or white, college-educated or high school drop-out, parent or single, economic status, religion, political beliefs, male or female, intergender, transgender, homosexual, bisexual, pansexual, asexual, introverted, extroverted, etc. I mentioned in my post that I don't feel like a second-class citizen despite experiencing discrimination. It's pretty understandable that many women do feel like second-class citizens and because of discrimination. The problem is that discrimination is an easy answer. I want to know -why- you feel discriminated against. Because everyone looks down at your breasts? Because you aren't paid as much as someone else? Because you're expected to be a mom? Because you aren't supposed to do male things? What are the reasons for why you feel like a second-class citizen? Ok, sorry it took me a while to get back on this one. Finals fried my brain. I guess the primary reason for me is that women are treated as sexual objects and exploited to sell things is high on the list. The way our culture is so very male centered also makes me feel like a second class citizen. It's fine. I was probably not seeing your point or just wanted you to explain it a bit more.
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Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 12:37 pm
I certainly don't feel as though I am a second-class citizen, by any means, however, I do feel that there are people who, whether realizing it or not, certainly perpetuate that feeling, male and female alike. Honestly, I think that with the way that women think, etc., and are often smart and good at expressing themselves but also often persuaded through their emotions, that while it's women who are the larger oppressors of women psychologically, I feel that it's because that the male-dominated society, by its very existence, has led these women to feeling the way that they do, that they need to do x and y to be a woman and that z and a are good things for them and b and c are bad for them, etc... and also to be more dominated by their reputation, which women try to protect in the sense that they feel it needs to be protected by perpetuating the male-dominance, and furthermore training their daughters and sons in this which creates ideals and people who don't even know where they come from and who, because of this, are very difficult to argue and reason with.
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